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Could you imagine if studies were done by a DR giving a 3 months supply of a drug and telling you "just log daily how you feel". That would be completely useless. They need vitals, physical follow-ups, scans, comparisons and this goes on for years with hundreds of subjects. Logging about a cramp could be anything from gas to something serious connected to the u/p clomid. We can't tell what it is without a physical exam. If you really want to be helpful, go around asking tons of DR's how they feel about this and then posts their answers here. Or better yet, encourage them to start a real study of clomid use on women who ovulate regularly. But denying or not seeing the severity of what you are doing and encouraging u/p clomid use is nothing more than dangerous.

Ladies, not starting an argument here, but you do realise that even prescribed clomidgoes unmonitored sometimes, so what is the difference? I myself have been prescribed it by 2 different Dr's and NIETHER dr monitored me whilst on it, 1 just told me to chart my temps, the other didn't say anything! Not only that, but I wasn't warned of cysts, OHSS or anything of a sort. If I had had a burst cyst or something I wouldn't have known what to look for! Luckily nothing like that ever happened and it worked first time, but still...I have also taken it u/p (not to conceive multiples but because I don't ovulate full stop without it, at least only maybe twice a year) and after doing my own research and utilising message boards, I learnt more than any dr had ever told me! I should also say that I don't recommend taking clomid u/p especially when not needed, but if people have already decided they are going to then it is best that they have SOMEWHERE to ask these questions and not be totally in the dark. I have always told my dr's when I have taken it U/P. I am pg now, and my dr knows how it happened, not where I got it or anything, just that I took it on my own back so to speak. I think it's important that someone in the medical field knows that you are taking in case something DOES go wrong, and yes I have heard of ladies where it does happen. Also allot of dr's are blaze about clomid more than women on message boards are. I can't beleive some dr's actually have their patients on it for over 6 cycles without a break! These women would be better off researching so they knew that was a big no-no. This is just my personal opinion and I think people need to understand that women are going to do this whether or not anyone else agrees! Me for instance, my point of view was why go pay a couple of hundred $$$ to get it prescribed to me, then also pay another $50 for the script to be filled, then not have it monitored anyway when I can just pay $30 and do it myself and not have it monitored? Honestly, what would you do in that situation?

I think the issue here is that a lot of these women are healthy and fertile and are only taking it in the hopes to conceive multiples. There really is no need for them to be on it other than their desire to have twins or more. And I think the other issue is what are they really taking since some of the medication is coming from other countries. Also there could be teenagers on here who get the idea to take this drug (which it is).

Oh also forgot to mention that I don't think a lot of these women are telling their doctors that they are on this drug. I've read more than a handful of posts on here where they've discussed how they can get around not telling their doctor.

why should i NOT mention the options? i got the info off here too didn't i? why should i not pa__s it on?...i am not going to pretend i am doing something and not tell others that that option is availavble...that would be two faced of me....afterall i got my info from here and from other similar thread and websites...and women...and decided to go down that route...i also had myself monitored and checked for problems when i got pregnanct as it is easy for me to do all i have to do is tell my doc and he books me in for a scanother women need to be aware of those options thats what i call research...and i alwys encourage that... if they fail to do their research i am in no position to make sure they do so..it is up to them to do it......and whether or not i do it doesnt matter cause there will be other threads and post which do the same...so if they don't get it off me they will get from someone else...as far as them not telling i didnt tell my doc or husband until i was on my 3 round...if they chose not to that is not something i told them to do...i have encouraged everyone to tell if they can which would obviously be a better thing to do...in the end they are all adults and should choose to do whats best for them...your att_tude is that of belittling...so you have all the right answers then i a__sume? everything you 5 choose to do is right then?...thenmaybe you should sit down and write a journal of your preoessional insight to everything....you seem totally sure that 'your ideas' are solid and people like us talk diddly dee!!! there are about 4 or 5 of the same people on here who play the same record over and over again...i can seriously say you keep stating the obvious (and i have shown a huge audience your posts already over these months and arguments and i have to say we do have a good laugh like right now...how can you be so transparent!!!) and bring such simple arguments to a complex and vast situation...there is no debth in anything you say..its like saying...don't climb on that tree you will fall...regardless on who is climibing, why they are climbing, what aid they may be using and whether or not they may be pexpereinced climbers..and when people try and explain their opinions you seem to put a deaf ear to it or your minds are just too small to understand it???.you all sound so very very simple to us here.....hence cannot undertand complex situations and fail to understand other cultures, other poeple's thinking, and other people's way of life and why they choose to do things the way they do...not all situations have to have solid explanations, not everything in life has to be or is black and white......i suggest you read sophie's world...a good 'amateur' beginning to human phychology!!!!maybe you may understand and be a bit more less idealistic in your views..and learn that not everyone has 'your strong one sided views' and never will do!!!!THANks GOD for that!!!!lol...have a nice day!

Um.. Lurker?.... an infertile womans chances of having multiples is much lower then a fertile womans. I have several buddies that have had IVF several times, multiple embryos each time, and only one of them is pregnant.. with a singleton. Yes, there is risk, but the risk is much lower then a woman who does not require the hormone boost, etc. The risk is calculated, doc_mented, monitored, and LEGAL. Women taking UP drugs compound their risks with their ignorance of the real science behind them. Study the books all you want. Until you have seen your ovaires on an ultrasound you have no idea what the drug is doing to you. Real infertile women who have had to struggle for their children have spent the time, money, and resources to make themselves as educated about their body and it's capabilities as possible. Women who want multiples for the "fun factor" ( what a joke) have not. Any woman who WANTS twins or more is doing it for the fun factor. There IS no other reason. Last shot at babies? You will be under a doc's supervision and maybe twins a possability. U/P users? not the case.

Lurker, a lot of women that have to take clomid or have IVF are terrified of conceiving multiples because they are informed about the dangers of a multiple pregnancy and the probability of selective reduction. In fact, I bet you that every single one of them would have rather conceived on their own and gone blissfully blind through their pregnancy and not be terrified every single day that this may pregnancy end up to be another heartache. Please, the issue in not a fertility drug here or modern day science. The issue is taking it, unprescribed and without a doctor monitoring it, solely for the purpose of multiples by women who have no problem what-so-ever conceiving. Do you not see the difference?

You are still missing my point. Clomid, prescribed and unprescribed, makes multiples which can result in potentially high mortality rate and complicated pregnancies. Invitro as well. You have taken this risk and women who take u/p clomid are taking the same risk. This is their choice, just as you had your choice. Wanting to have twins or multiples is ideal for many women, fertile or infertile for differing reasons, not necessarily for the "fun factor" as you say. Ask a women whether she would prefer to go through pregnancy ONCE and have two children or go through pregnancy TWICE for two children. What would be your response? Also, some women who are INFERTILE take u/p clomid to have a child, or children because they cannot afford the cost. Some unfortunate women may not have a house to sell or car to sell just to conceive !! Many women are doing this for differing reasons. You cannot say that all women taking u/p clomid is doing it for fun to achieve multiple pregnancy. Have you actually taken a poll? Some have other reasons. Yes, they are taking a risk with u/p clomd but you have taken the same risk, even under doctors supervision. You cannot deny that there are risk factors to both and the risks to unborn fetuses. I am glad you all have had successful pregnancies but as you mentioned, there are alot of babies that do not make it to full term because they are multiples and ultimately die. Well you took that same chance. Also, not all women would view raising multiples as a difficult experience. You may have had a difficult experience raising multiples but some others may not have that same experience. Some women are prepared with lots of family, friends to help out. You all really need to be more open-minded.

I think you're missing the point. The women taking u/p clomid are doing so to to TRY TO get impregnated with multiples. They are upping their dosages, changes the dates they take the drug to (in their minds) up their chances for two or more. When a woman is under the supervision of a doctor, the doctor does a complete medical history and monitors the drug user. Yes I'm sure there are some doctors who do not monitor but I believe that is not the case for the majority of INFERTILE women who are prescribed the drug. If there are two many follicles (I believe that's the term they use) then they do not do the IUI or inform the user to not bd because their chance of multiples are high. I know a lot of women who took this drug (who were infertile) and they did NOT want multiples because they knew that it is a high-risk pregnancy and did not want to risk it since this could be their one shot at motherhood. They did not want multiples "to get it over with" or "to fit it into their schedule".

obviously the risk the u/p users have is completely different since their doctors and sometimes their own family do not even know they are even taking the drug.

If they cannot afford the cost of taking a prescribed drug how are they going to afford the medical care for twins or more or even just the every day care of them when they are brought home. Any idea how expensive multiples are?

who thinks a twin or triplet pregnancy is easier than going through two or three pregnanies is in complete denial and knows nothing about a high-risk multiple pregnancy.

Raising multiples, especially when there is one or more children in the family already, is a difficult experience. I don't care who you are, there is always a difficult time. Whether it be when they are infants or toddlers. You think a mother is sleep deprived when there is one newborn, multiply that by two or three. And when one is still in the NICU when you bring one home. What do you do about the other baby? Do you leave one with a family member while you go back and forth to the hospital a week after you've just had major surgery? What about when one baby is sick and you are by yourself and you need to bring all the children with you to the pedi? What if they all get RSV or rotavirus? And scheduling their Early Intervention Services around your schedule or your other childrens' schedule?

To Lurker: You've had some really great responses so I'm not going to beat a dead horse. But for fun, I'd love to meet a mom of high order multiples that doesn't find her life challenging. Maybe you don't have any children yet, but I think most moms find ONE 2 yr old challenging, let alone 3.

to Lurker - having multiples is challenging no matter what you say - maybe more challenging for some than others. You are missing the point so I wont go further, but I will say I LOVE being pregnant!!

Ladies, you are making a statement that all women taking u/p clomid are doing it for multiples. Once again, women have differing reasons for taking u/p clomid and unless you have done indepth research into this and have taken a poll, you cannot make that statement. I have heard women relay different reasons for taking u/p clomid. Some women on these posts don't even mention their reason for taking it. Have you individually talked and asked these women? Also, child bearing is not easy so you would definitely find many women saying they prefer to do it once, have multiples and get it over with. Come on, we are women here and 9 months of being pregnant is not something all women enjoy. Obviously a twin or multiple pregnancy is not easier to go through than an individual pregnancy but women would have to have had the experience to completely understand that. You all had to go through it once to come to that conclusion. These other women will learn the same thing once they go through it. As for medical costs, medications labeled for infertility, such as clomid, injectables etc in some areas are not covered by insurance, however, the prenatal care and pregnancies generally are covered. It truly depends on where you reside, the laws there and of course, the individual coverage they have. Thus, my point is some women cannot afford the cost of clomid since there medical may not cover it. Hence, they get it unprescribed. And yes, like you said, some women may not have coverage at all. Yet, another reason to get u/p clomid but how many of those women are out there. You don't know the circ_mstance of all women. You cannot make statements which are unsubstantiated. My point is you make statements that are your opinion and your opinion only, without credence. You base your information on a few friends and a few people on-line. There are millions and millions of women out there and you have no idea why women are doing this and taking the chances they are and what, if any, consequences they have or are experiencing. Some women taking u/p clomid are, in fact, going in to their doctor to get checked, according to some of the posts. Also, you have no idea how many women have been either successful or not. Lastly, yes, I agree that children are challenging. But like yourselves, that didn't stop you. Plus, these women will learn by experience, same like you all. All fertility drugs have a level of risk factors. U/p clomid, of course is more riskier without medical supervision but women apparently are willing to take risks for DIFFERING reasons. I can probably explain this until I am blue in the face but I still think you all will miss the point.