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Ladies, you are making a statement that all women taking u/p clomid are doing it for multiples. Once again, women have differing reasons for taking u/p clomid and unless you have done indepth research into this and have taken a poll, you cannot make that statement. I have heard women relay different reasons for taking u/p clomid. Some women on these posts don't even mention their reason for taking it. Have you individually talked and asked these women? Also, child bearing is not easy so you would definitely find many women saying they prefer to do it once, have multiples and get it over with. Come on, we are women here and 9 months of being pregnant is not something all women enjoy. Obviously a twin or multiple pregnancy is not easier to go through than an individual pregnancy but women would have to have had the experience to completely understand that. You all had to go through it once to come to that conclusion. These other women will learn the same thing once they go through it. As for medical costs, medications labeled for infertility, such as clomid, injectables etc in some areas are not covered by insurance, however, the prenatal care and pregnancies generally are covered. It truly depends on where you reside, the laws there and of course, the individual coverage they have. Thus, my point is some women cannot afford the cost of clomid since there medical may not cover it. Hence, they get it unprescribed. And yes, like you said, some women may not have coverage at all. Yet, another reason to get u/p clomid but how many of those women are out there. You don't know the circ_mstance of all women. You cannot make statements which are unsubstantiated. My point is you make statements that are your opinion and your opinion only, without credence. You base your information on a few friends and a few people on-line. There are millions and millions of women out there and you have no idea why women are doing this and taking the chances they are and what, if any, consequences they have or are experiencing. Some women taking u/p clomid are, in fact, going in to their doctor to get checked, according to some of the posts. Also, you have no idea how many women have been either successful or not. Lastly, yes, I agree that children are challenging. But like yourselves, that didn't stop you. Plus, these women will learn by experience, same like you all. All fertility drugs have a level of risk factors. U/p clomid, of course is more riskier without medical supervision but women apparently are willing to take risks for DIFFERING reasons. I can probably explain this until I am blue in the face but I still think you all will miss the point.

There is no other reason than that to take u/p clomid to shoot for mulitples. If there were fertility issues in hand, the DR would easily prescribe clomid. These women have stated that they don't have a problem conceiving. If they are suffering from multiple m/c, clomid isn't going to help. There is something else going on. I didn't take any fertility drugs. I conceived mine naturally. But I can guarantee you that I was smart enough before having twins to know that it would be a high risk and scary pregnancy. If babies lives weren't at stake, I would wish twins or triplets on every single one of you ladies so you can come back on here crying about how hard it is and how right us multiple moms were. I guess some people need to be burned to believe that fire is hot. Being told just isn't good enough.

For one, there are other reasons beside getting multiples, that women are taking u/p clomid as I stated in my post. You are being closed minded. Two, some coverages do not cover infertility issues, hence, there is no doctor to prescribe infertility meds. Three, not all women have stated they want multiples. Four, obviously multiples are high risk, but you are somewhat late with all the clinics and specialists which have been around for the past 8-10 years that women are going to which result in multiple pregnancies. Five, the majority of women conceive multiples through infertility. This arena is booming. Yes its hard and risky, but women are willing to take the chance.....lots and Lots of women. Including the women who recently posted. Like I said, I can talk until I am blue in the face -- you still won't get it !!

I will have to respectfully disagree with "OneTwoThree". While I agree with many posts she has made-especially those directed at Yas 2000-There are more reasons than "Just wanting multiples" to take u/p clomid. I am such an example. My DH and I have one 6 year old son and have been suffering from secondary infertility now for 5+ years. I have been to the Doc-more than one, actually, and have been told that everything seems to be fine. I do not have PCOS or any other recognizable disorder and have been told that sometimes "It just takes a while." I tried vitex, RR leaf and some other herbs, they did nothing. I do ovulate, but irreguarly . My doc suggested clomid, but when we checked into it, we got a BIG surprise....our insurance would drop us like hotcakes if we even touched the stuff. And when I say "us"-I mean my whole family... it would be VERY difficult for us to find another company to pick us up if they found out we'd been prescribed clomid. they do not even want the possibility of having to pay for a multiple birth...the possible NICU stays, increase chance of medical problems, ect. We were seen as a liability. So, I am not taking u/p clomid for multiples. In fact, I would prefer to just have one healthy baby. I have done MAJOR research on this drug and spent months reading about all the risks and what side effects to expect. I just want a baby and for those of you in, or who have been in, similar situations, you know that I'll do anything within my power to make that happen. May God grant us all wisdom and understanding in each of our lives....Thanks for hearing my side

I love it. Women "willing to take their chances . . . " You all sound so brave. I have posted this many times and have yet to see a reply. But for my own amus____nt I'll give it another try . . . It's not your risks that concern me. Burst an ovary. You're a grown-up (hopefully). You can certainly decide what to do with YOUR body. However when your decisions have the capacity to harm a BABY, then I say something. Taking u/p clomid increases your chances of multiples (as do all fertility drugs, however when monitered and administered to infertile women the risk goes down dramatically). Having multiples increases your chances of many pregnancy complications including prematurity. 100% of quads are born premature. Over 90% of triplets are born premature (prior to 36 weeks). Over half of twins are born premature (prior to 37 weeks). Prematurity can lead to low birth weight, anemia, jaundice, respiratory distress, lung disease, NEC, PDAs, infections, hearing loss, blindness, hernias, life-long disabilities, learning disabilities, organ failure, death, among other problems. Will every u/p clomid pregnancy end in dead quadruplets? Of course not. Most clomid pregnancies will be uneventful ones. But not all. So before you tell me that these brave women are "willing to take their chances" step back and think about who is really going to face the risks. That's all I'm asking. Tell me you're willing to let your baby(ies) face the consequences. Tell me you don't care if you end up visiting 24 week triplets in cute, matching isolettes.

Well we have a women who just shared her story about infertility and the fact that she is taking u/p clomid for a reason other than wanting multiples. Believe it or not, there are those women out there. These women are looking for other women who can share their experience in order to gain more knowledge, that of which they might not get otherwise (this could be even worse, healthwise). You say you are just speaking to those who are taking u/p clomid for multiples but quite honestly, you all have lumped everyone taking u/p clomid into the same category based on alot of your responses. I have seen posts where women will ask a general question about u/p clomid without revealing why they are taking it and your responses are quite negative. "Go see a doctor" is not a luxury for all women out there so they come to this forum to share experiences where they can learn from others experience, whether good or bad. I believe it is truly a blessing to have multiples and of course, it a blessing to alot of women to just have ONE child. Why rain on their parade. It is rather hypocritical to be against multiples due to the mortality rate but yet be one of those women who have gone through infertility meds and have taken the same risks. Yes, yes, yes, we all know that u/p clomid is more risky without doctors supervision but keep in mind, however, that some women are, in fact, going to the doctor for monitoring post clomid. In any event, women will take the chance, if they want to conceive one child or more to LOVE, like the rest of you. Ok, now I am going from turning blue to purple.

You've got to be kidding right! I personally know of a woman whom allowed her dr to put back 6, yes count them, 6, embryo's, well that poor woman ended up with 6 sacs, 5 of which developed into fetuses, she then was told she had to do selective reduction, my heart goes out to her, but those babies were living beings with heartbeats, what do you have to say to that! IVF seems to be the main source of multiples these days, don't see a great deal of natural anymore, nor many with clomid, most I see are from IVF mostly from those whom have put back 3 or more ending up with twins or more. Should they not have to answer to you ladies as well? I have nothing against these women, but they and their dr's are taking huge risks by putting back more than 1 egg each time! I am one of those whom took clomid u/p, yes I could have easily had it prescribed and have in the past, but as I said before, for me who was unmonitored anyway, why bother, to me that would have just been throwing my money at a dr who didn't care about me anyway, only about getting his money! I preferred to just tell my GP what I had done and he was fine with it. He actually told me that it was using my initiative as I had had a miscarriage the previous cycle which I feel was from conceiving on a cd 63 ovulation with likely a c___ppy old lining! Pull your heads in, we aren't all out to have twins. I joined this board entirely because there were others here also using clomid u/p not to conceive multiples. Yes I would be happy with 2 but 1 is all I was aiming for, I am already high risk and my chances of doing it all again are slim and would depend on the outcome of this pgcy. With my last I said it was my last because it was so hard and I was so scared, but the outcome ended up fine so decided to give it one more go.

Hey Linda.. I know of several women who have gone through IVF several times.. usually 3 embryos transferred each time, sometimes more, HUNDREDS of thousands of dollars spent... and NO babies. One of them, after IVF for 6 years, finally got pregnant with a beautiful singleton. She never transferred less then 3.. so had she transferred less, chances are she would still be out there, waiting for her child. Your story of your friend with 6 babies... not normal. Not average. Not usual. You have to take the average when making an argument, not use an extraordinary story.. as it does not make any point except that hard things happen to some people. The INTENT behind the U/P usage is just as important as the usage itself... and a regular doc can prescribe Clomid, it's around $30 each month for the meds, and you would be legally taking the drug. Why NOT go legal if you are already qualified to take the drug???

Lurker.. it is clear from your posts that you have no real life actual information on fertility treatments and women who undergo them. Meet these women in person.. make friends... Your "facts" are scewed to a gross degree. Side note, ALL of my buddies suffering from infertility would be thrilled with a pregnancy, but if they got to choose, they would choose singleton pregnancies every time. This is not a small sampling of women. Online groups number in the thousands, and my local group has more then a hundred members. They would never choose to risk the health of their children just to increase their numbers. This is true for every infertile I have met. Many times, the multiple embryo transferrs are just so that she has a CHANCE of becoming pregnant with ONE.. not so she can try for multiples. If she does stay pregnant with multiples, I have NEVER met the educated woman who preferred that. The risk is just too high. They do all they can to keep their children, but they would ALL rather have them one at a time, given the option. The differece between them and the women taking U/P drugs is intent, largely. In this forum, specifically, the women are abusing this drug for just that purpose. That is why the argument is here in the first place. Women on the TTC forums aren't being approached about this decision ( although still a bad one) but these ladies are AIMING for a high risk pregnancy.. that is why they are on the MULTIPLES board rather then the Problems Conceiving board. And.. a side note.. You don't seem to grasp that the RISK for conceiving MULTIPLES in a normally FERTILE woman are HIGHER then the RISKS for an INFERTILE woman. What is so hard to understand about that??? THAT is the difference.

Frances, Where I live an normal GP CANNOT prescribe clomid, it has to be a OBGYN or fertility specialist and they cost quite a bit to see, i'm not in the USA, I did ask my GP for clomid and he gave me a referal to my OBGYN, so he knew I wanted to do it legit, but I wasn't wasteing my money when I could get it another way. Yes I could afford to go and get it legit, but it's all just a money making thing for most dr's. I also didn't want to go to my OBGYN for it as I still hadn't cancelled my pgcy appointment from my MC, it would have hurt to much to see him for clomid when I should have been there for my first scan. Also most women whom do IVF actually hope for twins, I don't blame them for that, they have tried hard to get pg and 2 is a bonus, but they know what the risks are and actually hope for 2, but the fact is, that is what they (allot anyway) ultimately are wishing/hoping for.

Gee Ladies, it looks like we lost alot of our dialogue, but I can't say that I blame the website. I think we may have gotten alittle to opinionated. I, however, truly found our dialogue rather interesting. I enjoyed your opinions and also being allowed to voice mine. Well, I will no longer be posting because I am leaving in a few minutes to catch my flight back to college for the spring. My x-mas vacation was great. Thanks for listening for the past several days and I wish you all the best of luck. Oh...and TripletMom, thank you for the well wishes for school. I saw it before they deleted our posts.

........ooops, that last post was by me, Lurker. Well signing off and also running out the door. Lurker (real name is Jessica).

What the heck happened? Did it get prett bad? It seemed to me that even though there were disagreements it was still very tame. Oh well.

Hi Yas! I wanted to drop in and ask you a quick question. I didn't see you over on the first trimester board so I came here to find you.............It is sounding like our pregnancies are getting more and more alike! You knew that I had food poisioning last week and was alone in the ER all day on Christmas. Well, like you I have been recovering from that all week....... I was having some pretty yucky morning sickness and yesterday it just dissappeared! Totally gone! I usually get it pretty bad. My last pg I was in and out of the hospital with i.v's.(The things we do to have babies!) :)............Anyway, a friend of mine suggested that take b6 and unisom. Well, I started taking the b6 but, not the unisom and now I have NO morning sickness. I am having a hard time believing it is from that. I am scared that something is wrong and my ms dissappeared. I remember reading that your ms went away for a while. Do you think I'm okay??? Your Friend Tiffany! Oh, and I am 5 weeks today...:)

Tiffany, are you having any more spotting? Do you feel like you are pregnant or have any other symptoms? When is your next appointment? I have heard of B6 along with Unisom but I never took it because the Unisom part freaked me out. I was even too scared to take Tylenol for my headaches which were pretty bad with my first pregnancy.

hi tiffany...well yes my cramps lasted for over a week....i really thought this was going to be a nightmare of a pregnancy. if it were to be viable pregnancy....but since this tuesday i have been better...i still have nausea and mild ms if i eat too great a meal but the thing thats most difficult is that i have extreme fatigue....i am just totally exhausted have huge mood swings and get 'angry' very very quickly..if it were up to me i just want to lie on my bum all day and do 'nothing'!!!lol...so far that is almost possible as my mum is around (what a blessing and at such a great time) and hence i can actually just sit back and relax while she looks after both my sons and ME!!!!!! i have no idea how i will cope when she leaves on tuesday and i think, its thinking about that is making me quite depressed!!!!! about your situation....if your not bleeding, have no cramps strange one esp and feel genrally 'normal'... i really wouldn't worry...but then the best rea__surance is to have acheck up...since the heartbeat of the embryo doesn't really start up until week 6 or more...doppler will be useless..so i suggest if you are really worried to ask for an early scan.....did you have one yet? do you know if you are having more than one? i am certain i have only one..as at 6 weeks that all we saw....there is still that little hope for miracle now and again that they will find another baby later...as i am already showing as if i am 5 months and this pregnancy is greatly different to my others....plus there was always that other sac...lol...but really my main focus is to get through these 3 months....am always wiping myself after the loo with the fear that i might find some spotting or bleeding!!!if you have any you MUST get it checked not just to ease your mind, but if things are god forbid not going as planned, one can deal with it straight away and then move on..i mean i'd rather know now then later if i were to loose my baby!so do get it checked if your really worried....!!! i have been just sleeping and slouching too tired to argue with people on here as they will never want to understand us anyway...and to be honest quite bored of it....hence i just pop in now and again and read some interesting posts and then carry on with my other hobbys!!!lol i wish everyone here a properous new year and lots and lots of baby dust and prayers in your ttc, and pregnancyies....tiffany i am sure you will be alright!!!!hope to hear from you soon..let us know if you get yourself checked!