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thats so wierd. id be scared. but i guess u know him more than ne1. just be care full tho n make sure lotsa ppl kno wots goin on

The thing is this, don't ever think you know someone because of past behavior, when their current behavior is so bizarre. THis is a lesson I learned in the last couple of years. People reach a crossroads in their life and sometimes they get lost as you said, but we are nothing more than the culmination of our actions. Ten years from now this guy could be in jail for murder and he could pinpoint this moment where his life changed, he could talk about how good he was before. You have to take him for what he is now, and he his moved beyond a few mistakes that can be forgiven because he's esssentially a good guy. This is INSANE! I mean that literally. Can you say whether he has a reason to have snapped a twig, can you say for sure he is not doing drugs??? Your focus has been on Harold and Ellie so you can't account for that much of his life. I love you to death Amanda but right now that att_tude has you as a big piece of steak in front of a ravenous animal. Yeah several might pa__s because they aren't bad, but why take the chance if there is one bad on in the pack. Don't let yourself sit there like that. It'd be understandable with just the phone calls or rumors, but this man has lost all feelings of other human beings, which is clear in the fact that he treated these girls the way he did, he wasn't good in the first place cuz he cheated on you, and he has brought your little girl into the mix. Everyone is capable of going crazy, just give them the right motivation. I bet you never imagined being a murderer, but I bet I could bring that out of you with the right motivation. Let me show up at your house with clear intent to hurt that little girl and Harold-call it self-defense but I'd bring your mind to that of a murderer. You need to talk to someone who knows the laws and see if you can get some safeguards up. Because even if he doesn't go as far as threatening you or Ellie, what if he goes far enough to put Harold in a dangerous position? What if he goes as far as to try to get Harold in trouble, or does so unintentionally?

I'm not going to be stupid about it, I've already said that. I'm doing what I can to protect my family. I'm not, nor have I ever been, a sitting duck. He may be crazy, I'm not saying that I don't think that's possible. He could be a murderer for all I know... I just don't fully believe it, therefore I'm not worried. I'll take the precautions, it's just not keeping me up at night is all. A guy did the same exact thing to my sister. He's a nice guy too. They just got too caught up in being in love and when time was supposed to help them forget and move on, it ended up idealizing the relationship. Then with every failed relationship the more they want to go back to that one. Even if it was when they were 11 (he was actually 12 haha) I'm not going to talk to him, I'm certainly not going to be alone with him or let him anywhere near Ellie. I just think he's depressed right now and is trying to search back to when he was happy. That's what I did when I went through depression. I was depressed for 4 years and toward the end of it, when I was fed up, I started surrounding myself with all the people I used to be friends with, and I tried to do the same things I did when I was happy. Of course it didn't work, I had left those things behind for a reason, but I was so dead set on being happy again that I practically forced myself into liking it. That's just what I think is going on right now.

you might "think" thast is what is happening but just remember you just dont know! its not worth guessing he,s nice really he,s probably just depressed..............as long as you stay away from him and remember that you dont know what his plans are. you say you think he,s depressed and is just trying to find a time in his life where he was happy?.................sorry but getting another girl to dye her hair red and get angry for not looking enough like you.....thats just insane! thats not searching back to when he was happy, thats obbsesion and it wouldnt suprise if this guy try,s to stalk you follow you ect! i really dont think you quite understand how much of a dangourous situation you could be in! i totally agree with V i think you have the wrong att_tiude towards this.......fair enough your not going to let it cause you to loose sleep but i think your being way to layed back about the situation.........you should listen to V by the sounds of it she has been in a simular situation

Wow i would definately not being taking this situation so lightly. But its your life, just like the 14 year old wanna-be mamas, you're set on your own views and opinions.

Ok... I don't know how many times I need to repeat this but I'm making the necessary precautions incase he has gone totally insane. I'm just not worried about it. I don't see what the point in trying to get me to worry about it is if I'm already being careful. What do you want me to do? Scream and cry, lock myself and Ellie up in a steel box so no one could ever get to us? I'm not going crazy about it, I'm not worrying about it. I feel like I was in his position a while ago and I had people who were accusing me of being crazy too. I even had to stay in a hospital over night because they thought I was going to hurt someone and/or myself. I wasn't, I never planned to... Being depressed, REALLY depressed, makes you do insane things. You become obsessive about your happy endings. That is what I THINK is happening. Sorry I can't force myself to think anything else. I realize that I am not SURE that's what's going on and therefore I am recording his voicemails, talking to my mom about it who will talk to the police when necessary. He's not following me home or anything, he hasn't asked to see me or Ellie, he's only wanted to speak with me. And I haven't spoken with him. So I really, really don't see what the problem is or why you would WANT me to worry. Worrying never got anyone anywhere anyways.

thats the thing your just saying he,s depressed! you dont know that! of course you think your doing everything you can but having your "its ok im not worried, he,s just depressed he wont do anything" att_tude sounds like your taking it way to lightly and your making yourself seem like nothing will happen...............you havnt explained what you are doing to protect yourself from this phsico? like newbaby said its your life you dont seem to understand what we,re saying so yea................good luck

Yes, being depressed maked you do insane things. All the more reason to be afraid of what may happen. I didnt mean to get you all defensive. I was just saying that i myself wouldnt take it so lightly. Its your life, your daughter. Your ent_tled to handle it how ever you see fit. Unfortunately there isnt much you can do anyway until something happens.

I just said I didn't know if he was depressed or not..... I get what you're saying I just don't see the point in you saying it because I don't see the point in worrying. You don't seem to understand what I'm saying. I acknowledge that sure, he might be dangerous, so I'm going to protect myself and my family. I'm not going to trust him, I'm not going to pretend like he's never going to do anything to hurt us. I just find it hard to believe that he will. He has absolutely no violent history, he has not attempted to hurt me, or Ellie, or my family at all. He's not following me around, he's not threatening me. I had one conversation with him and he was quite obviously unhappy. He's not asking me to take him back, or anything weird. His voicemails are asking things like "What did we used to do? How did I react when we did them?" He's not even asking to see me. He seems, quite genuinely, lost. He's well known for being a bad liar as was made clear at the beginning of this post. I'm not blinded thinking he's a wonderful person and wonderful people could never do anything wrong or hurtful. I just think he's trying to find his way... It comes off creepy, fine. As I've said, I was in the same position. If I'm not letting him near me or my family, if I'm making sure I have all the evidence I need incase something happens... What does it matter what I think?

Yes i do understand what your saying and im just giving my opinion. Thats what the forum is for right? You said you THINK hes depressed, that good enough. What exactly did i say to upset you? That f i was in the situation i would handle it differently? Because thats all i said. Im not telling you how i view your situation or what i think you should do about it.

No, no haha I'm not upset with you NewBaby. I'm not particularly upset at all. I'm frustrated that Angel is not getting what I'm saying and I keep having to repeat myself. You really didn't offend me at all :)

Oh ok :) I wasnt sure who you were talking to, lol.

Sorry Newbaby! I should have been more clear.

Oh god, didn' t mean to turn this into a pain. Amanda, just know that I worry-sorry it comes with the territory of a worrywort. As we've talked about before, there are a lot of similarities between us, and i know I have just walked right into being victimized in situation. I'm not accusing you of that, but god if I can prevent it. I'm not thinking you are dumb enough to just sit there, I know better. An alarm just went off in my head and I wanted to give you all the info I can, but at the same time I never wanted it to destroy in the manner of not sleeping. A lot of times guys who harra__s you, they want to bother you just to see you sweat. Not saying that's him, just in general-you should never give anyone that pleasure. You are just going to have to deal with my worrywart b___t looking out for ya cuz you don't know it yet but I've put in an order with God and adopted you as my little sister. DEAL WITH IT!!! LOL!

Hahaha. I mean, you can worry if you want to. It's not like I can stop you haha. I just really don't feel like I should be worrying. I dunno. I've told a bunch of people, it's kinda 50/50 on those who are worrying and those who aren't. A lot of the ones who aren't worrying are the ones who are close to him. There's no real evidence that he wants Julie to be like me anyways. It's quite possible that the clothing and hair dye is a coincidence. The way he wants her to dress is the way I dress now, not when I was 11... And I'm not even sure he knows that my style has changed. The last time he saw me was when I was 14 and we ran into each other at the movies. I was all gothic-punky back then. I have a much more grown-up and sophisticated style now. Also he's always had a thing for redheads. So.. Yeah. I acknowledge the possibility that he's dangerous, but I don't fully believe it.

Sorry girls, I didn't mean to sound defensive because I wasn't. As I said I was annoyed with having to repeat myself to angel. She kept bringing up points I had already covered I felt like I was basically copy and pasting... ANYwho haha. Yeah I haven't heard from him since Brianna called me. I told her to tell him I really didn't want to talk to him and I asked her to be a friend to him if she could. She also stopped talking to him around the time that I did, so I figured if he wants to reach someone from his past, she'd do just as well. I suppose it worked because she messaged me on myspace last night saying that they talked for hours and he's not really feeling like himself anymore so she invited him to a get-together she's having with her church group. It's not church related, it's just with her friends from church. So I figure if I'm right he might leave me alone. Brianna also said that he didn't mean to offend or scare me and he doesn't really know why he said the things he did. I'm still not letting my guard down, but I don't feel like he's going to bother me anymore.